Darth Vader VS Gandalf

[Goldleader]

That was pretty awesome to say the least! It doesn't surprise me that Vader won,
in many vader stories he loses a limb and most people think he has been defeated so they hesitate before going in for the kill, which vader exploits every time:P

My only dislike of this video is due to Vader's prosthetic limbs and life support suit, he can not conjure up lightning nor ever be immune to it as a regular sith learns(such as Sideous).
To conjure up the force in such a way requires living organic material. Even if Vader outstretches his hand in his force choke gesture, his hand is not the object in which the force is being manipulated, it is actually the nub of his severed arm channeling the force.
Much for the same reason, unlike Yoda or other jedi/sith that focus there mind and channel the force into their outstretched arm to act as a guide to lift objects, the objects Vader is able to manipulate by using the force(such as his force scream in ep.III, or his whirlwind of objects at Luke in ep.V) is moved with his mind alone. This took much 'rehab' at first in the days following Vader's transformation into the black armored cyborg.

sorry, maybe that was obvious info, but i had to rant..
i did love that video aside from the lightningXD

[Master Rel]

This is an interesting thread.

The video was well done though the front end was a bit slow compared to the cleaner middle and fair finish.

There are issues of course.

Taking each for their strengths then comparing the two lists i suspect the results would be different.

I would say 4:5 Gandalf wins.

Gandalf (Olórin wisest of the Valinor Maiar) being described as a demi-god would be reasonable...an avatar of a lesser god would also be reasonable.

If I were the director/editor of the video...I would have played it completely out...

Vader strikes down Gandalf
Vader fights to resist Sauron after donning the ring
Vader throws the ring down and in a rage tries to destroy it
(big badda boom)
Vader wakes, finds Gandalf the White standing over him offering a hand to stand
Gandalf offers council to Vader
Vader realizes that he has purged the affect of Sauron and Pruneface as well
Vader leaves, revitalized, and seeks to destroy the pruney one

[Kaiden Shardsbane]

You, sir, get a point.  I didn't realize before, but that makes a LOT of sense.  I could easily see it happening that way.

[Ravenseye8]

I know it is common net wisdom that Vader can't do force lightning, but I wonder how set in stone it really is.  At the time of the OT, Palpatine was the only one seen doing lightning so it was assumed by many Vader couldn't.  Since then, however, pretty much every major sith can and has used force lightning.

The nature of the force seems to me that he could start the lightning at the tips of his fingers rather than channeling it through his body (which I've never really seen discussed anyway.  Does it make sense that the lightning goes through the body rather than simply being a gathering of the force energy around the sith?  Isn't that how the force works for every other technique?  Manipulating the energy that surround and binds the world.)

I think if we saw Vader in media like a TV show or new movie, he would use force lightning.

[Kaiden Shardsbane]

Well, keep in mind that Palpatine might never have taught Vader the Force Lightning technique.

Even if it were possible to channel Force lightning without his real hands, Palpy might have wanted him to think that the mechanical hands weakened him.  To keep him in his place.

[Ravenseye8]

Well, keep in mind that Palpatine might never have taught Vader the Force Lightning technique.

Even if it were possible to channel Force lightning without his real hands, Palpy might have wanted him to think that the mechanical hands weakened him.  To keep him in his place.

Possible, but he taught Dooku, so I don't think it's the kind of thing Master's generally keep from their apprentices.  Vader saw it firsthand as well in his fights against Dooku and when Palpatine used it against Mace, so it isn't like Palpatine could say to him "yeah, I don't know that one Lord Vader, sorry."

There's also TFU, where Starkiller knows force lightning, which would mean Vader showed him how since he was a secret apprentice that was kept from the Emperor.

[Kaiden Shardsbane]

Good point.  But let's not derail this too far.

[Ravenseye8]

I think it's a valid discussion deriving from the video, but I'll refrain from further posts on the subject unless the OP says it okay.

[Master Rel]

Seems on topic to me 

Maybe Vader considers  the use of the force lightning too taxing on his few threads of humanity?

The use of force lightning as taught by pruney might be soul rending.

[Goldleader]

In the force unleashed book version, it made mentions of how Vader supplied sith holocrons to his secret apprentice Starkiller and how he learned many techniques in that manner. But also in the EP. 3 visual dictionary on the page that includes Vader as the cyborg we all know and love, there is a section where it states how Lightning is something vader, his prosthetic limbs would never be able to learn. It also states how it is his primary weakness to his life support systems/breathing apparatuses.
However in TFU II, Vader uses the force to REDIRECT electricity through some pylons at starkiller on kamino while shielding himself from the effects.

To tie this all in to the topic at hand, that is my proof in disagreeing with the lightning used against Gandalf.

[Big Boss]

Very interesting points all of you and Rels right, this discussion is on topic. I would prefer if you guys talked about each of the characters abilities since I and most likely others don't know all their true abilities especially gandalf's.Since I know very little about LOTR. 

[Master Rel]

Few random bits about Gandalf to help with the process...

1. The Istari (Men called them Wizards) took the form of Men, but possessed much greater physical and mental power. For over 2,000 years, Gandalf worked most faithfully against the rising powers of evil in Middle-earth.

2. He is the wisest and most powerful of the Five Wizards: although some have conjectured that Saruman was more powerful due to his pre-War position as head of the Wise, Tolkien wrote that Saruman knew Gandalf possessed the greater power and wisdom and hated him for it.

3. Gandalf stayed to confront the creature a second time at the Bridge of Khazad-dûm. As the Balrog began to break the bridge, Gandalf told the Fellowship to flee, because only he, being of equal status to the fiery demon, was able to face it.

4. Gandalf pursued the creature for eight days until they climbed to the peak of Zirakzigil. Here they fought for two days and nights. In the end, the Balrog was cast down and it broke the mountain-side as it fell. Gandalf himself died following this ordeal and his body lay on the peak while his spirit travelled outside of Time.

5. Gandalf was "sent back", resurrected by Eru, returning as a more imposing figure, Gandalf the White. After being found by Gwaihir, he was healed of his injuries and reclothed in white robes by Galadriel in Lorien.

6. While Gandalf was facing the Balrog, he charged his sword Glamdring with lightning. He then struck his foe and killed him. It is unknown whether Gandalf actually summoned the lightning or simply attracted it toward Glamdring, but either way, his sword had extra power, enough to slay the Balrog of Morgoth.

7. Some of his spells...Call Lightning, Blinding Light, Shield of the Istari, Create Fire, Destructive Blast, Word of Power, Illusions, Call Legendary Beasts, Magic Push, and more.

8. Staff and Glamdring...magic weapons and tools...used in tandem in melee with surprising results...2000yrs of practice...

[Kaiden Shardsbane]

Hmm... if nothing else, the 2000 years of practice with his staff would win him the fight.  Vader only used a lightsaber for half a century at most.